Same thing with the wolves. They are creeping down from Yellowstone into Northern Nevada. Those definitely carry a $100,000 Federal fine if you kill them. Ranchers up there (Idaho) are having a fit with those imported gray wolves from Canada. Federal agency imported them into Yellowstone. Won't allow us to kill them, and they are reproducing very fast - with no natural predator anymore (illegal).

I think sometimes what these people in Washington DC forget is that 100's or 1000's of years ago, we all lived together, wolves, bears, etc. Except we killed the bears and made sausage patties, and we just killed the wolves (only the starving ate that) - kept a few that behaved to create/domesticate dogs (slightly more dated there). Once that bear hurts or kills someone, probably next spring, attitudes will change - for a little while, but it still carries that fine, unless you are gov't official.

Example - feral horses. When it gets to be to many of them here, we complain, they round them up, and take them to another valley. Where ever they went, those people complain, and they round them up and take them back here. (Yes they do auction the young'ens.) Archaeological records, although not precise and without bias, show that horses went extinct here 10,000 years ago. If it takes 50 - 100 years to become "Naturalized", wouldn't 10,000 years qualify as - hey buddy - you don't belong here?

To them, the feds, a mistake is okay if it's lasted 50 or so years here.

There are fossil records showing humans in America (North/South) that are 250,000-500,000 years old. Any judgement that people make thinking America started in 1500 AD is totally flawed. This place has had hunters (documented) for 10,000 years (Ref: Natural History of White and Inyo Range: Publisher University of California Press, 1991 ISBN 0520068963, 9780520068964). It's only recently that colonialism and crazy personal intervention has created a breeding ground of predators that hunt those that made the legislation.

That's what I think :)

Is it treasonous to want to secede from the United States? Many think the question of secession was settled by our Civil War. On the contrary, the principles of self-government and voluntary association are at the core of our founding. Clearly, Thomas Jefferson believed secession was proper, albeit as a last resort. Writing to William Giles in 1825 he concluded that states “should separate from our companions only when the sole alternatives left are the dissolution of our union with them, or submission to a government without limitation of powers.”

Keep in mind that the first and third paragraph of the Declaration of Independence expressly contemplate the dissolution of a political union when the underlying government becomes tyrannical. Do we have a government without limitation of powers yet? The federal government kept the union together through violence and force in the Civil War, but did might really make right?

Secession is a deeply American principle. This country was born through secession. Some thought it was treasonous to secede from England, but those “traitors” became our country’s greatest patriots. There is nothing treasonous or unpatriotic about wanting a federal government that is more responsive to the people it represents. That is what our revolutionary war was all about and today, our own federal government is vastly overstepping its constitutional bounds with no signs of reform. In fact, the recent election only further entrenched the status quo.

If the possibility of secession is completely off the table there is nothing to stop the federal government from continuing to encroach on our liberties, and no recourse for those who are sick and tired of it. Consider the ballot measures that passed in Colorado and Washington state regarding marijuana laws. The people in those states have clearly indicated that they are ready to try something different where drug policy is concerned, yet they will still face a tremendous threat from the federal government. In California the feds have been arresting peaceful medical marijuana users and raiding dispensaries that state and local governments have sanctioned. This shouldn’t happen in a free country!

It remains to be seen what will happen in states that are refusing to comply with deeply unpopular mandates of Obamacare by not setting up healthcare exchanges. It appears the federal government will not respect those decisions either.

In free country governments derive their powers from the consent of the governed. When the people have very clearly withdrawn their consent for a law, the discussion should be over. If the feds refuse to accept that and continue to run roughshod over the people, at what point do we acknowledge that that is not freedom anymore? At what point should a people dissolve the political bands which have connected them with an increasingly tyrannical and oppressive federal government? And if people or states are not free to leave the United States as a last resort, can they really think of themselves as free? If a people cannot secede from an oppressive government they cannot truly be considered free.

Ron Paul - 11/19/2012

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zqi6paX3ong&feature=youtu.be

He's old, it's okay, but it's a really good speech. You can play it in the background and do other things on the computer while it plays out. You won't see him run in 2016.

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One Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

The creator was a Socialist.

Wiki: The Pledge of Allegiance was written in 1892 by Francis Bellamy (1855–1931), who was a Baptist minister, a Christian socialist,[3] and the cousin of socialist utopian novelist Edward Bellamy (1850–1898).

After the Civil War, we really lost our right to secede, if you don't believe me, I'll send you laws and regulations stating so.

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